For many decades now Scotland’s biggest export has been people. The brightest and best bailing out so that they can make a better life in places less afflicted with the cancer of socialism. As a result of this, an education system that fails most of those in it, hostility towards capitalism and continuous bad governance Scotland is utterly incapable of earning the money that it spends, just like Greece. But the Jocks are lucky, they can continue to enjoy the lifestyle that they can’t afford because the English taxpayers provide the charity that pays for it.
In March last year the Institute for Fiscal Studies calculated the shortfall at £7.6 billion every year. This is money the English taxpayers are having to work to earn only to throw it over Hadrian’s Wall. The last census of Scotland put the population there at 5.295 million. This means the charity from the English amounts to £1,435 per person every year for every single Scottish resident. They should be saying “thank you very much†to the English taxpayers.
In July this year the Centre for Policy Studies did further research and concluded that, yes, without English charity Scotland really would be just like Greece, but without the sun.
Now, in October, the Taxpayer’s Alliance have done their research. They lay out the facts then they state that to balance the books after devolution Scotland would have to raise basic rate of income tax from 20p to 39p and double VAT to 40 per cent. Or, alternatively massively cut spending on services such as education and health. Nicola Sturgeon isn’t telling people these truths.
It is true that Northern Ireland and Wales are also dependent on English charity. But at least they have the manners not to whinge about it. The Jocks are ungrateful for all the money that is thrown at them. Their biggest danger is if the English taxpayers get fed up with this and kick Scotland out of the union. Very quickly the Jocks would be living in a third world country.
Nicola Sturgeon has a genius masterplan for devolution. She is going to get EU charity to replace English charity. She expects the EU to just give Scotland £7.6 billion a year. Really. Obviously the chances of this happening are precisely zero, as the EU have repeatedly said. The EU budget is in real trouble with most member states having failing economies. And following Brexit the English charity to the EU will stop, so they will be in even bigger merde.
The Scottish people continue to vote SNP despite the sleaze, the lies, the thuggery and the bad governance. Why do they? Quite simply the tribal bigotry of the SNP really appeals to dim, uneducated people. And there are a disproportionate number of these in Scotland. As we all know. And as they keep on proving.
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Genuine question: with all that you say, why is Wedtminster so uninclined to let them become independent?
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Jo,
“The Union”
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“The Union” bwaaahahahahahahahahaha that’s it, that’s your reply, bwaaahahahahahahahahaha, couldn’t you even try to dress it up a bit. Love your comedy, keep it up.
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Steve,
Thank you so much for proving one of my points in the article.
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GONI LET US GO AND PERISH IT WILL MAKE SURE ENGLAN KEEPS AW ITS DOSH
WE JOCKS CAN GROW SPUDS AND FING TAE EAT
AND PLENTI O RAIN SO LOADS TAE DRINK.
MONEY WULL BE MADE OOT OF WOOD WHISC WE CAN BURN IN OOR FIRES
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Bob,
I am impressed with your command of the English language.
Surely a result of what SNP have done to the Scottish education system.
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Kick the ‘jocks’ out then if we are such grubbers.
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According to the Financial Times, you’re wrong.
“An independent Scotland could expect to start with healthier state finances than the rest of the UK.” Scotland subsidises the UK by billions of pounds every year, and has done for many decades. On the rare occasions when it’s forced by Parliamentary rules to tell the truth, the UK government admits that fact plainly.” Feb 2014
http://archive.is/vcQ78
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Ian,
The FT agrees with me now.
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Bruce I explained all this earlier how GERS figures do not represent what an independent Scotland would look like. It is GERS figures being used in this FT article — here is a direct quote from the FT link you just posted “Scotland’s notional share of British oil revenues from £9.6bn in 2011-12 to just £60m in 2015-16.” Oil and gas industry ‘worth £35bn annually’ to UK economy. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-27129660
Scotland wouldn’t share tax revenues with rUK when we regain our independence just like rUK wouldn’t share their revenues with any other country. Of course not all the £35 billion is from North Sea oil but more than £60 million of it is! A lot more!
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And sorry for the earlier rant lol it’s been a long night mate
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Bruce you got it wrong mate. You got it it all wrong. I don’t even know where to start or even if it’s a waste of time discussing this or anything with you as am just some ill-educated jock lol but I’ll bite my tongue and waste an hour of my life in the small chance an onlooker may actually believe any this rubbish.
Before we tackle the ‘article’ lol I am amazed someone calling himself a marketer would sell anything like this. I work in sales, it’s a strange way to go about trying to get people to buy into your cause by referring to your target audience as dim, uneducated bigots,.. Sorry Bruce I forgot it’s not aimed at trying to convince Scottish voters of the ‘facts’ is it? More just a self obsessed work of fiction to appeal to British Nationalists and get a few likes and re-tweets? Anyway I know you’re probably no gonna publish this reply and like I said I’m no sure where to start so I’ll just run through them one by one.
Scotland’s overspending problem
In Scotland spending is 16% higher than the English average. This is mainly due to the remoteness of a many parts of Scotland. Sorry for that. I should also point out many other regions of England also receive more than the English average and some don’t that’s the way averages work mate. Through the Barnett formula London, Yorkshire & SW get more than Scotland per head but that doesn’t stop you harping on about how Scotland gets more than the English average (minus the fact Scots pay more in per head) sorry about that.
Secondly the figures used in this are from GERS which is Scotland’s balance sheet just now (i.e within the UK). Outside the UK (when Scotland is independent) Scotland wouldn’t have a geographic share of North Sea oil revenue (Scotland would have all tax revenue from north sea oil and tax revenue raised from all Scottish exports including Textiles (0.8b) Gin (1.2b) Scotch Whisky (5.2b) — which currently stands at 75 per cent (%) a bottle and worth over 5b each year to the UK economy NOT included in GERS. But the major flaw in these figures is not that they are calculated by using our geographic share of North Sea Oil revenues (WITHIN THE UK — which wouldn’t apply when Scotland is outside the UK)it also begs the question how can Scotland get a geographic share of something when geographically most of it’s in Scottish waters in the first place. I don’t see anywhere in GERS that includes Scotland’s geographic share of cars produced in England or Scotland’s geographic share of profits from CITI bank and revenues from financial services in the city the oil revenue financed and built in the 1980s from nothing. The UK was on its knees at that point mate maybe you’re too young to remember and probably been indoctrinated from tory central office into blaming it all on the Labour government of the day. Strange how a recent study showed folk born in the 70s are better off than their 80s counterparts.
So anyway how did the nice bankers repay us for letting them gamble our money (and yours) to extort money from other banks, invest in companies and properties that didn’t exist and bankrupt the country? They rip us all off with their bonuses and PPI and dodgy market deals. That must be the same kinda thanks you give to EU nationals for keeping your NHS afloat for the past 30 year! Are you aware many nurses working in England now feel unwelcome and under-appreciated in the place they call home. It’s shameful mate but that’s another blog in itself.
Pretty much the rest of the image above is nonsense as the deficit wouldn’t be as high as explained above but you are correct on the EU 3% deficit target. Incidentally this a target and not a rule. The UK, Italy, Ireland, Greece, Spain to name a few have all had deficits much higher than 3% but no doubt you would argue those countries weren’t applying to be members they already were members so the same would not necessarily apply to an independent Scotland which would be correct. So I half agree with you there although for the last 8 years Scotland has balanced the books unlike every other country in the EU, it’s only because of the collapse in the global price of oil due to over production Scotland has went from surplus to deficit. Recently the value of crude has risen again also Russia and Saudi Arabia have just announced they’re going to limit what they produce, this combined with the falling value in the pound due to brexit doesn’t look good for UK inflation but with the price of oil rising it might help pay towards the UK deficit of 68 billion. The pound has always been over-valued anyway, a millstone round the neck of Scotland and the UK. 😉
FYI the people of Scotland are better placed to judge if the Scottish Government are doing a good job rather than some guy from Coventry that’s probably never set foot in the place. We had an election here mate in May and the SNPs share of the vote increased from a landslide five years ago. Scotland is a vibrant, wonderful place to be just now, don’t believe a word of the decisive nonsense I have many No voting friends, my mum & dad voted No last time I don’t love or respect them any less for their political beliefs i don’t agree with them but they are entitled to their opinion as you are yours. You should come visit mate, (bring a good jacket and a thick pair of socks).
You know am not even gonna go there with the text of this tbh i find it really insulting and am tired of having to rise above you lot but am also determined you won’t drag me down to your level so I’m gonna go before i say something i might regret lol
Ignorance is bliss. Sleep well mate.
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Jim,
I am half Scottish and used to live in Scotland, just one of many things you have wrong. Your derisory tone is no way to conduct a debate and it hides a diatribe that is riddled with error.
You are still clinging on to oil revenue when both production levels and price have collapsed. Production levels cannot rise again and the swing producer that sets the price is USA fracking, so the price isn’t going anywhere. You don’t seem to realise that North Sea oil is very expensive to extract, which means that much is now being pumped ashore and sold for a lower price than what it costs to produce. This is why the Scottish oil industry is shedding vast numbers of jobs.
Under Barnett the Scottish government has far more to spend, per head, than the English get. But this extra is wasted on bad governance and socialist stupidity, not the distance between crofts. Most of the Scottish population are in the central belt with a high population density.
You make silly mistakes by saying an independent Scotland will get the whisky duty from the whole UK, when it is obvious that they won’t. They will only get the whisky duty from Scotland. You don’t explain “tax revenue from exports” when there isn’t any. The turnover of Scottish industries that you list has nothing to do with the government budget deficit. You really ought to read an economics book.
You have a big dig at the banking industry. But the banking crisis was mostly Scottish banks, rescued by a Scottish Prime Minister, using English money to save Scottish jobs. These are the undeniable facts.
Getting back to the article. In it are links to three separate articles with three separate pieces of research. They all come to the obvious conclusion that an independent Scotland would have spending that vastly exceeded income. You can’t hide from this. The SNP is profligate and bad at governance, Scotland’s benefits bill is horrendous, Scotland uses taxpayers money to pay for overseas students to study in Scotland. Anyone who lives in Scotland sees the waste and reads about it in the papers.
There is no way that Scotland can find the money to pay for this spending, other than the charity it now receives from England. You might not like this but it is the irrefutable truth.
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Bruce you’re unbelievably deluded. If we are such a tax drain on England then you should be trying to get rid of us in order to save money. You have no credible argument. You focus on oil yet it’s only a small part of the economic output and has been clearly shown to have minimal impact during the downturn in value, which is now rising again. You also have a very derisory tone. “jocks” hasn’t been used as a positive term for many many years in my experience. I think your insulting, half scots or not.
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Bruce it’s telling that the man who says things here like ” ..Jocks are utterly parasitic” suddenly whinges about some else’s derisory tone just when that someone else is successfully challenging your ‘analysis’. Deary me – glass houses etc.
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David,
Not really successfully. I forensically destroyed all Jim’s points.
Easily done because he was completely wrong and didn’t understand government finance.
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Lol you forensically destroyed all my points did you? You haven’t answered a single point anyone on here has made instead you just say “you’re wrong” or “You have no idea”, why not try to explain to us why you think we’re wrong, you know like how you expect us to do? You completely ignore the points we make then claim you destroyed them. Unbelievable!
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Bruce: You are still clinging on to oil revenue when both production levels and price have collapsed. Production levels cannot rise again
Jim: oil production levels (which actually increased over the last year) http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/09/26/north-sea-oil-and-gas-output-rises-but-investment-dries-up/
Bruce: [no reply]
—
Jim: So why then does Scotland not receive a geographic share of tax revenue of goods produced in England like Scottish produce gets shared across the whole UK? I can’t see anywhere in GERS that includes Scotland’s geographic share of cars produced in England … I thought we were pulling & sharing our resources or does that only work one way?
Bruce: [no reply]
—
Ian: According to the Financial Times [and statement from the UK government] you’re wrong.
Bruce: The FT agrees with me now [using figures based on GERS]
Jim: I explained all this earlier how GERS figures do not represent what an independent Scotland would look like. It is GERS figures being used in this FT article — here is a direct quote from the FT link you just posted “Scotland’s notional share of British oil revenues from £9.6bn in 2011-12 to just £60m in 2015-16.†Meanwhile The Oil and gas industry is ‘worth £35bn annually’ to UK economy. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-27129660
Scotland wouldn’t share tax revenues with rUK when we regain our independence just like rUK wouldn’t share their revenues with any other country [obviously]. Of course not all the £35 billion is from North Sea oil [ in Scottish waters ] but more than £60 million of it is! A lot more!
Bruce: [no reply]
—
Jim: The UK government currently receive more than £5 billion in tax revenue from whisky exports each year
Bruce: You have no idea. You think Scotland receives alcohol duty from USA or Japan?
Jim: No mate that’s my point the UK receive those taxes not the Scottish government [links provided from UK Gov, Scot. Gov and the whisky Association]
Bruce: [awaiting reply] but i won’t hold my breath lol
—
Bruce: I forensically destroyed all Jim’s points.
I could go on with these quotes from this here page but suffice to say you haven’t forensically destroyed anything.
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My derisory tone?? Sorry Bruce I speak only the way I am spoken to — I can’t believe you are half Scottish and to write such nonsense in the first place. Dim uneducated thugs, tribal bigotry? If that’s not derisory I don’t know what is! lol Listen this isn’t about hate or bigotry just cause we would rather control our own country doesn’t mean we hate anyone. From your derisory tone it appears the only bigot here is you.
Man I could discuss Scottish independence with you for hours and i wouldn’t mention oil but the very first sentence in the blog discusses “Scotland’s biggest export” which for the last 40 years has been oil you brought exports into it I’m just merely stating when independent Scotland would not only get a share of tax revenues but we would get all revenues as we would be independent.
I posted a link earlier [from the bbc] dunno if you bothered to even read it but here is another one again from the bbc http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-26326117 , it clearly shows Scottish GDP per person EXCLUDING oil and gas revenue is £20,571 compared to UK GDP per person of £20,873. Scotland is clearly not reliant on oil but it is still one of our biggest exports (for now and the next 50 years), just stating the facts here. The data excluding Oil & Gas revenue is good to know as the oil will run out one day and we need to know if Scotland could still support itself, which it could. Which was the point i was trying to make. Sorry for the confusion. I am fully aware of oil production levels (which actually increased last year just the value that fell) http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/09/26/north-sea-oil-and-gas-output-rises-but-investment-dries-up/
Whisky exports – https://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jan/27/scotch-whisky-industry-scotland-tax
The UK government currently receive more than £5 billion in tax revenue from whisky, why on earth would those revenues not go towards Scotland’s GDP in the even of independence?
And not just whisky but all exports. Anyway am falling into your trap here by even discussing all this as Scottish Independence isn’t really about all this but as you brought it up in your blog I am setting a few facts straight. Thanks for the reply
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Jim,
You still have no idea.
You think Scotland receives alcohol duty from USA or Japan?
So an independent Scotland would only get alcohol duty from Scottish consumption.
You do seem very confused about where government revenue comes from.
In the case of Scotland today a lot comes from English taxpayers. This is an irrefutable fact.
You should be saying thank you.
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A reasonable person’s sensible commentary? Thank the Lord you’re not unreasonable. Here’s something to consider. Every time a barrel of oil is sold from Scottish waters (UK balance of payments), the UK government receives 70% of the value in taxes. Therefore, for a $50 price, UK Treasury receives $35 of which Scotland receives $3.50 [UK retains $31.50]. If Scotland were an independent nation, she would earn this $35 per barrel. Even if oil plummeted to $20 per barrel, the 2001 price, Scotland would receive $14 pb which is four times what she receives at the moment. I’m afraid the charity clearly runs the other way.
The next time you write a reasonable person’s commentary be sure not to use racist epithets like ‘Jocks’.
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Tony,
You really have no idea how North Sea oil is taxed.
But you can learn.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum_Revenue_Tax
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No Scotland doesn’t receive any alcohol duty from the USA or Japan which is my point. Tax duty from Scotch Whisky exports goes towards the UK economy which is currently worth 5.2 billion a year in global exports. Exports to the US alone were worth almost £820m in 2013. In an independent Scotland those tax revenues would go to Holyrood and not Westminster. You’re welcome. https://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/jan/27/scotch-whisky-industry-scotland-tax
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Jim,
It is amazing how little you understand taxation and government finance.
Exports do not contribute to Scottish government income. There is no VAT on them, no excise duty.
So there is nothing from exports going to Westminster and there would be nothing going to Holyrood.
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Bruce it’s a good job i got patience lol
YES I KNOW the Scottish government do not get income from exports that’s what I’ve been saying, the UK government receive those taxes on Scotland’s behalf.
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/spirits-duty
[Excise duty on spirits straight from UK.GOV]
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-31003387
[Scotch whisky contributes almost £5bn to the UK economy and supports more than 40,000 jobs, according to research commissioned by the industry.]
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/whisky_export_duty
[Scottish Government have no locus in the collection of Whisky export Duty,
as this is a reserved issue.]
http://www.scotch-whisky.org.uk/media/16603/dutyburdenfs10.pdf
[shows a brake down of who gets what from a bottle of whisky from their website and shows the UK government currently take 76% of the cost in tax on all exports of whisky. The distilleries get £2.57 for each bottle of whisky costing £10.85]
http://www.scotch-whisky.org.uk/media/70581/economic_impact_web.pdf
[Scotch Whisky adds £3.3 billion directly and its total impact is to add nearly £5bn overall to UK GDP. Every £1 of value added in the industry produces another £0.52 of value in the broader economy. … The industry is the UK’s largest single food and drink sector.1 Jan 2015]
So you’re saying all these sources are wrong? Sorry but I am more inclined to believe what I read from numerous sources incl. The Scottish Whisky Association themselves, the UK government and the Scottish government – who should know a thing or two about it or do they not understand taxation either?
Wither you like it or not mate the UK government receive 5 billion a year from Whisky exports (maybe some years not as much as 5bn and other years more but an average of 5bn a year.)
I have no idea where you get your information from mate maybe so rather than just patronise folk by saying “you’re wrong” or “I’m amazed how little you understand” which is a recurring theme on this blog you might want to back up what you say with some actual proof 🙂
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Jim,
You still don’t get it, do you?
In the article there are three separate independent reports.
These are researched and written by people who understand far more about government finances than you do.
And all three say that the Scottish government spends many billions more than it can earn.
So the English taxpayers make up the difference.
These are irrefutable facts, but you are in utter denial and keep up bringing up peripheral issues, such as Whisky exports, that have nothing to do with government finance.
Which just shows your complete failure to grasp the issues.
The constant derisory tone of your comments really goes to prove that you have no valid points to make.
For readers here are the GERS figures that you talk about:
http://www.gov.scot/Publications/2016/08/2132
So an independent Scotland would be bust from day 1, with nobody to bail them out.
There is no way the EU would let Scotland in with such a huge deficit, it is three times what EU law allows.
So Sturgeon would have to massively increase taxes or massively cut public services. Either of these would lead to a mass exodus of Scots into England. We would need a big fence, armed border guards and landmines to keep them out.
Even The Economist says that she is on a different planet: http://www.economist.com/news/britain/21701332-brexit-has-sparked-calls-another-independence-referendum-also-made-it-trickier
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Yup, you’re right mate i don’t get it. I don’t get how you can’t understand that those 3 reports you refer to are basing their assumptions based on this years GERS figures including the deficit. (a. The deficit Scotland has within the UK with a national share of it’s own produce b. When Scotland is independent the revenues currently reserved to WM reverts to Holyrood).
So you got three separate reports from ‘experts’ are these the same experts that forecast the global oil crash or the financial crisis in 2007. No a never thought so lol listen Bruce to be fair to your experts if I took one look at GERS without accounting for our geographic regional share (that wouldn’t apply when Scotland is outside the UK) I would probably come to the same conclusion. Don’t get me wrong mate GERS is a very useful report it tells us what Scottish expenditure is but the revenue is based on Scotland having a national share of reserved matters.
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Jim,
No.
The IFS report is based on OBR figures and their own economic work.
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*correction -Don’t get me wrong mate GERS is a very useful report it tells us what Scottish expenditure is but the revenue is based on Scotland having a geographic regional share of reserved matters.
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Bruce. Let’s be done with the debate. Work out a way via Change.Org or other means to force a debate in the House of Commons around repealing the Act of Union. That way you get what you want and Scotland get’s it’s independence to sink or swim and we all stay pals.
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But we wouldn’t all stay pals when thousands of Scottish “immigrants” come flooding over the border because their country is on it’s arse. Only guessing but I reckon Westminster wants them to stay because by keeping them in The Union they only have to put up with the SNP’s constant moaning, instead of having to pay for extra benefits/extra housing/extra medical expenses etc. Oh, and then of course there’s the cost of the wall and border that will have to be re-built. But perhaps we should make The Scots pay for it?
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Love Scotland hate SNP 1/5 scots live in England 2/5 vote leave EU 60%. HS2 start glasgow Edinburgh existing routes south to London SAVE Billions. Move Trident nuclear submarine base far better in Falkland islands. northern power house british steel dockyard jobs build rig ship tankers siphon deep water 500 x 50M x 5inch hose empty turbine 24/7 clean power UK.
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**correction + edit lol – GERS is a very useful report it tells us what Scottish expenditure is but the revenue is based on Scotland’s finances for 2015/16 while part of the UK with a geographic regional share of reserved matters that wouldn’t be the case when Scotland is independent. Also to pick up on an earlier point you made “you are in utter denial and keep up bringing up peripheral issues, such as Whisky exports, that have nothing to do with government finance.” Sorry mate but Scotch Whisky exports are worth over £5 billion to the UK economy. [GDP] The Government (currently the UK gov as it’s a reserved matter) take 76% in tax which is £3.8 Billion that’s not peripheral when I am trying to explain to you how Scotland’s deficit isn’t what you’re making it out to be.
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Jim,
You really don’t get this whisky tax thing.
It is levied in the country where the whisky is drunk, not where it is made.
There is no tax, and therefore no revenue, on exported whisky. After Scottish independence the English government would still receive the tax on whisky drunk in England and the Scottish government would get nothing.
The Scottish whisky industry is largely English owned via Diageo etc We paid to build the industry up so we get the profits.
The whisky industry does pay PAYE and Corporation Tax, but these figures are very much smaller than those that you are throwing around.
It is amazing that you still don’t get these very simple basic principles. We are not talking about what the private sector is doing in Scotland. We are talking about Scottish government income and expenditure. You are very confused between the two.
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SWA pay corporation tax (after receiving £2.57 every time a bottle of Whisky is sold from their profits after paying their overheads, staff wages etc) so it’s that that’s worth over £5 Billion to the UK economy? Either way mate exports generated £5 billion (in 2015) for the UK balance of trade (UK GDP). Which after independence would go towards Scotland’s GDP. That’s not peripheral, GDP is how we measure a country’s wealth. Directly the government receive £3.8 billion of that in tax am only going from what I’ve read from SWA themselves, The UK and Scottish Gov if you disagree with me then you disagree with them.
Same can be said btw for Scotland’s growing gin industry (also spirit taxed at a UK level) which makes up 70% of all UK Gin production and is worth £1.76bn to the UK economy (as it’s reserved to WM) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-35371403 and also applies to all other reserved matters incl. electricity (which also collects VAT), coal, oil & gas.. It all adds up mate… look after the pennies.. in this case look after the billions and the ‘deficit’ looks after itself.
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THE SCOTTISH WHISKY INDUSTRY pay corporation tax (after receiving £2.57 every time a bottle of Whisky is sold from their profits after paying their overheads, staff wages etc) so it’s that that’s worth over £5 Billion to the UK economy? Either way mate those exports generated £5 billion (in 2015) for the UK balance of trade (UK GDP). Which after independence would go towards Scotland’s GDP. That’s not peripheral, GDP is how we measure a country’s wealth. Directly the government receive £3.8 billion of that in tax am only going from what I’ve read from SWA themselves, The UK and Scottish Gov if you disagree with me then you disagree with them.
Same can be said btw for Scotland’s growing gin industry (also spirit taxed at a UK level) which makes up 70% of all UK Gin production and is worth £1.76bn to the UK economy (as it’s reserved to WM) http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-35371403 and also applies to all other reserved matters incl. electricity (which also collects VAT), coal, oil & gas.. It all adds up mate… look after the pennies.. in this case look after the billions and the ‘deficit’ looks after itself.
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Jim,
You really are confusing UK economy with UK government finances. They are different things.
Google tells me that about 10,000 people are employed in the Scottish whisky industry. Average salary say £30K so total industry pay £300 million. Income tax on this is max £60 million, which in government finance is pennies.
The SWA figure for exports do no create any tax for anyone, except for PAYE and Corporation Tax, so you are wasting your time going on about them.
After independence the Corporation Tax would mostly be paid in England because the Whisky industry is mostly owned by English companies.
The UK government receives excise duty on Whisky drunk in the UK. An independent Scotland would receive excise duty on Whisky drunk in Scotland. Nothing more.
The whisky excise for the entire UK is about £1bn, Scotland has well under a tenth of the UK population. So independent Scotland would receive about £100 million in Whisky excise duty. Once again pennies. Scottish public sector spending is £68bn a year.
It is utterly beyond me that you fail to understand these basics, even after they have been pointed out to you.
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I get the feeling there’s quite a few things that are utterly beyond you lol (sorry couldn’t resist)
You are the one that mentioned Corporation Tax mate [£2.57 for each bottle of whisky costing £10.85] I didn’t even mention it or income tax. Listen does it really matter what I say I get the feeling am not gonna change your mind but I will try one last time I’ll try to keep it brief
The problem here is with GERS and the way the figures don’t account for when Scotland is independent as we’re not. (yet lol)
GERS shows us what Scotland currently receive with a geographic share of Scotland’s own produce. When Scotland is independent that would no longer apply. Furthermore since we’re equally pulling & sharing our resources why is it WM allocates Scotland a share (8.3%) of tax revenue from something produced in Scotland while Scotland doesn’t receive a geographic share of tax revenues from goods produced elsewhere in the UK? Doesn’t pulling & sharing work both ways in an equal family of nations? Do you think that’s fair from a Scottish point of view?
Or even a half-Scottish point of view? 😉
Listen mate I’m half joking on that last point, I hope you realise this! In case you don’t of course I don’t think Scotland should relieve a geographic share of revenues produced in another country nor would i want Scotland to take what doesn’t belong to us but as it stands Scotland is in the UK, “an equal family of nations” (or so we’re told) surely then the pulling & sharing our resources must work both ways in an equal union? Just an example mate to show the absurdity of this lopsided union Scotland finds itself in.
Last words: Bruce we’re not all some frothing at the mouth nationalists hell bent on independence at any cost! They only exist in tory gutter press mate. I can’t speak for anyone else but I am more liberal than anything else (small l) and look at most things from all sides I am more saddened than angry by your blog that’s derisory in itself then you complain when others leave derisory comments, that’s just wrong mate if you want respect give it. If you want civility show it. I don’t take that attitude and view that all No voters are dim and uneducated bigots simply because I disagree with them. They thought they were doing the right thing for Scotland, they were wrong (in my opinion) but I can’t fault their motives. Or the No voters just simply wanted to remain British because they felt British then that’s up to them I respect that in the same way I would hope they would respect that I feel Scottish. Of course you would rather think of us as a bunch of illiterate morons that possibly makes you feel safer in your own decisions.
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Jim,
GERS doesn’t take account of the inflated price the English pay for Scottish electricity. A hidden subsidy to the Scots built into every electricity bill.
After Scottish independence the English will be able to generate our own electricity far more cheaply. And thus pay lower bills.
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Bruce,
Then why was Cameron so keen on wanting us to remain part of the UK?
Regards
Willie
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Willie,
The “Union”.
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Using GERS to “blame” Scotland for its notional deficit is nonsense. Scotland had no control over the loss of tax offices recently, for example, and it’s impossible to manage any of the things that affect business creation like corporation tax, regulation, minimum wage and so on.
Even then, the shape of the UK-Scottish economy is distorted. We curently send billions south (mostly to London) for all sorts of things, from the Home Office to Defence to the DVLA. That simultaneously shrinks the Scottish economy and artificially inflates the London/English/rUK economy. Even though Scotland has civil service jobs, its a fact that many people are required to move south because there are far fewer promoted posts in Scotland. My back of a fag packet calculations show at least a couple of billion pounds and 30,000 jobs moving back to Scotland on independence. The cumulative effects of that on GDP, income tax receipts and reduced social security spending would be more than enough to balance up the current difference between the UK deficit and the notional Scottish deficit.
There’s more. The BBC spends £100m each year on English football but only £4m on all Scottish sport. More generally, only about 55% of licence fee cash raised in Scotland is spent here, whereas it’s well over 100% for England (again, mostly London.) Once you start tallying up all of these things it becomes very clear that “English charity” and “sponging Jocks” are just tired, false, Anglo-nationalist racist tropes that serve no purpose in adult debate.
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Sorry Kenny,
You have not read the article and followed the references.
So your reply is a waste of electrons.
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I’ve come late to your article Bruce, apologies. But, from the points you make, it seems the only sensible thing to do is kick Scotland out of “The Union”. Myself, like many other supporter of Scottish Independence, I will never be happy until we are independent of Westminster. I fully expect it will eventually come to violence though, because Westminster has no intention of letting it happen. And, with that in mind, I am still fairly fit and able and would happily become a Scottish Pensioner Terrorist!
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What a no nothing knob, keeps spouting the same old (wrong) shite.
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Joseph,
Other than insults you add nothing to the debate.
You are further proof of the failed Scottish education system under SNP.
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Sound like the gist of your reply to any objector is “you’ve failed to read / understand my article.’
And the gist of your bigotry against the Scots (despite an entire section in this Blog against just that) is below.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=025oibV_Cfw